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daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
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 Posted: Thu Mar 18, 2010 11:53 pm Post subject: Puzzle 10/03/18 Advanced |
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| Code: | +-----------------------+
| . . . | . . 9 | 3 8 . |
| . 6 . | . . . | . . 9 |
| . . 8 | 1 . . | 7 . 6 |
|-------+-------+-------|
| . . 7 | . . . | . . 1 |
| . . . | . . 7 | . 3 . |
| 8 . . | . 1 2 | . . . |
|-------+-------+-------|
| 7 . 6 | . . . | 1 . 2 |
| 2 . . | . 9 . | . . 3 |
| . 1 9 | 7 . . | 6 4 . |
+-----------------------+
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Play this puzzle online at the Daily Sudoku site |
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Mogulmeister
Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1151
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| Posted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | 1)There's a nice finned skyscraper on 5s with the fin at r3c1. Whether the fin is true or not, the 5 at r1c3 is eliminated.
2)At the same time, there is a simple xy chain, pincers at r8c3 and r1c9 which guarantees the removal of the 4 also in r1c3
It would have been nice to have been able to achieve steps 1&2 simultaneously by utilising the remote pair <45> at r8c3 & r2c7 as achieved in other daj Puzzle 10/03/17 ___ BBDB as VH+ unfortunately not this time. 5 at either pincer toggles 4 in the other but the same can not be said of 4 forcing a toggle to 5.
Much elimination follows but we’re not done.
3)Colouring removes a lot of 5s which completes this very nice puzzle.
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Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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I am stuck after being able to do nothing more than an M-Wing on 45.
This has been, at least for me, the hardest DAJ puzzle in quite some time. I can see the finned skyscraper, but don't care to use them.
| Code: |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 1 7 25 | 245 6 9 | 3 8 45 |
| 345 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 | 45 1 9 |
| 3459 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 3459 345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 7 3458 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 458 45 | 6 9 1 | 58 7 3 |
| 35 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
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arkietech
Joined: 31 Jul 2008
Posts: 1834
Location: Northwest Arkansas USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty R. wrote: | I am stuck after being able to do nothing more than an M-Wing on 45.
| Code: |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 1 7 25 | 245 6 9 | 3 8 45 |
| 345 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 | 45 1 9 |
| 3459 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 3459 345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 7 3458 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 458 45 | 6 9 1 | 58 7 3 |
| 35 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
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You can set the 2 in r1c3 with a fancy finned fish. Later look for remote pairs. |
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Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | You can set the 2 in r1c3 with a fancy finned fish. Later look for remote pairs. |
How fancy? I'm not too good on regular finned fish, not to mention fancy ones. At any rate, I assume the fish has to be 5s in order to set the cell=2. based on my limited understanding, I don't see a finned swordfish, jellyfish or squirmbag.  |
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Mogulmeister
Joined: 03 May 2007
Posts: 1151
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:30 pm Post subject: |
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| The combination of the finned skyscraper then the M wing eliminates the 4 & 5 leaving 2. There's then a nice colouring on 5's which gets rid of a whole load of them. |
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arkietech
Joined: 31 Jul 2008
Posts: 1834
Location: Northwest Arkansas USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:53 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty R. wrote: | | How fancy? I'm not too good on regular finned fish, not to mention fancy ones. At any rate, I assume the fish has to be 5s in order to set the cell=2. based on my limited understanding, I don't see a finned swordfish, jellyfish or squirmbag. |
| Code: | +----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 1 7 2-5 | 245 6 9 | 3 8f45 |
| 345 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 |*45 1 9 |
| 3459 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 *2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 *3459*345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 7 3458 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 *458 *45 | 6 9 1 |*58 7 3 |
| 35 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
There is a finned Franken sword on 5 at r8b34 c237 the fin is at r1c9
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keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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Marty,
here is what I see: Grouped coloring on a skyscraper: | Code: | +-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 1 7 2-5 | 245 6 9 | 3 8 45b |
| 345a 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 | 45 1 9 |
| 3459a 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 3459 345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 7 358 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 458 45 | 6 9 1 | 58 7 3 |
| 35A 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58B |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+ |
Look at R9C19.
One or both of A or B is false (not 5). One of the cells a is true, and or b is true. Any cell that sees both cells a and the cell b cannot be 5.
After that, and some work, choose your poison: A BUG+1 or a classic remote pair.
Keith |
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keith
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Posts: 3355
Location: near Detroit, Michigan, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:00 pm Post subject: |
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Marty,
I suppose this is a finned skyscraper: | Code: | +-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 1 7 2-5 | 245 6 9 | 3 8 45b |
| 345c 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 | 45 1 9 |
| 3459a 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 3459 345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+
| 7 358 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 458 45 | 6 9 1 | 58 7 3 |
| 35A 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58B |
+-------------------+-------------------+-------------------+ |
Either the 5 skyscraper Aa-Bb is true, or c is true. Either way, R1C3 is not 5.
Keith |
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daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Marty R. wrote: | I am stuck after being able to do nothing more than an M-Wing on 45.
This has been, at least for me, the hardest DAJ puzzle in quite some time. I can see the finned skyscraper, but don't care to use them.
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Another perspective on the same pattern others have already mentioned. What you're missing is a Sashimi X-Wing where <5> is missing in r1c1 but counter-balanced by the presence of <5> in r23c1.
| Code: | Sashimi X-Wing c19\r19 w/fin cells r23c1 => r1c3<>5
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
| 1 7 2-5 | 245 6 9 | 3 8 *45 |
| #345 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 | 45 1 9 |
| #3459 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
|-----------------------+-----------------------+-----------------------|
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 3459 345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
|-----------------------+-----------------------+-----------------------|
| 7 3458 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 458 45 | 6 9 1 | 58 7 3 |
| *35 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 *58 |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------+
# 81 eliminations remain
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As Keith mentioned, it's very much like a Skyscraper, but the presence of two candidates in r23c1 restricts any eliminations to the box containing them. |
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Marty R.
Joined: 12 Feb 2006
Posts: 5770
Location: Rochester, NY, USA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2010 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you for the responses. I'll have to check out Franken and Sashimi.
| Quote: | | Either the 5 skyscraper Aa-Bb is true, or c is true. Either way, R1C3 is not 5. |
That one I follow but prefer not to use finned stuff. |
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oaxen
Joined: 10 Jul 2006
Posts: 96
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| Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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This was a good one! For me the fun with sudoko is to find the spot where I can make the game to be a one steper. I have a feeling all the puzzles have that opportunity!?
This time first in the second round i understood that one of the 3's in block G, namely in r7c2 is the winner.
Lars |
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tlanglet
Joined: 17 Oct 2007
Posts: 2468
Location: Northern California Foothills
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| Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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| arkietech wrote: | | Marty R. wrote: | | How fancy? I'm not too good on regular finned fish, not to mention fancy ones. At any rate, I assume the fish has to be 5s in order to set the cell=2. based on my limited understanding, I don't see a finned swordfish, jellyfish or squirmbag. |
| Code: | +----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 1 7 2-5 | 245 6 9 | 3 8f45 |
| 345 6 2345 | 23458 7 3458 |*45 1 9 |
| 3459 3459 8 | 1 345 345 | 7 2 6 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 349 2349 7 | 3489 348 6 | 2489 5 1 |
| 6 *2459 1 | 4589 458 7 | 2489 3 48 |
| 8 *3459*345 | 3459 1 2 | 49 6 7 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
| 7 3458 6 | 3458 3458 3458 | 1 9 2 |
| 2 *458 *45 | 6 9 1 |*58 7 3 |
| 35 1 9 | 7 2 358 | 6 4 58 |
+----------------+-----------------+-----------+
There is a finned Franken sword on 5 at r8b34 c237 the fin is at r1c9
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Dan, I also had a problem getting this puzzle started. I am familiar with finned, Kraken and sashimi fish but simply failed to see the step on 5s.
However, I do not understand a Franken fish. I studied the pattern you identified but still don't understand the thing. Please provide the details.
Ted |
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arkietech
Joined: 31 Jul 2008
Posts: 1834
Location: Northwest Arkansas USA
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| Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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| tlanglet wrote: | Dan, I also had a problem getting this puzzle started. I am familiar with finned, Kraken and sashimi fish but simply failed to see the step on 5s.
However, I do not understand a Franken fish. I studied the pattern you identified but still don't understand the thing. Please provide the details.
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first if the fin r1c9 is 5 then r1c3 <>5
if r2c7 is not 5 then r1c1 or r1c3 is 5 and r1c3<>5
if r2c7 is 5 then r8c7 is not 5 and r8c2 or r8c3 is 5
if r8c2 then r6c3 is 5 and r1c3<>5
if r8c3=5 then r1c3<>5
Hope this helps. |
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daj95376
Joined: 23 Aug 2008
Posts: 3854
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| Posted: Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:07 pm Post subject: |
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Alternate perspective of finned Franken Swordfish r8b34\c237 w/fin r1c9
Consider the candidate cells in [r8]
| Code: | (5): r8c2 - r56c2 = r6c3 - r1c3 [b4] used as link in elimination
(5): r8c3 - r1c3
(5): r8c7 - r2c7 = r1c9 - r1c3 [b3] used as link in elimination
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[c237] contains ever cell used except r1c9 |
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